Discussion:
Jai guru Dev
(too old to reply)
P.N.
2009-10-23 19:31:08 UTC
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http://www.srigurudev.net/
Bhairitu
2009-10-23 20:55:44 UTC
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Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM? Maharishi gave the definition and it is the tradition of
masters NOT just Swami Brahmananda Saraswati. In other traditions it
means their lineage. This makes TM'ers look naive.
P.N.
2009-10-24 06:48:36 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM? Maharishi gave the definition and it is the tradition of
masters NOT just Swami Brahmananda Saraswati. In other traditions it
means their lineage. This makes TM'ers look naive.
Please remember what Mahesh yogi always said "TM is not tantra".
Bhairitu
2009-10-24 18:53:13 UTC
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Post by P.N.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM? Maharishi gave the definition and it is the tradition of
masters NOT just Swami Brahmananda Saraswati. In other traditions it
means their lineage. This makes TM'ers look naive.
Please remember what Mahesh yogi always said "TM is not tantra".
Non sequitur. That has nothing to do with what I said.
P.N.
2009-10-25 10:51:00 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM? Maharishi gave the definition and it is the tradition of
masters NOT just Swami Brahmananda Saraswati. In other traditions it
means their lineage. This makes TM'ers look naive.
Please remember what Mahesh yogi always said "TM is not tantra".
Non sequitur. That has nothing to do with what I said.
But you do realise that TM is a Vedic meditation and not a tantric
meditation.
Bhairitu
2009-10-25 16:52:52 UTC
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Post by P.N.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM? Maharishi gave the definition and it is the tradition of
masters NOT just Swami Brahmananda Saraswati. In other traditions it
means their lineage. This makes TM'ers look naive.
Please remember what Mahesh yogi always said "TM is not tantra".
Non sequitur. That has nothing to do with what I said.
But you do realise that TM is a Vedic meditation and not a tantric
meditation.
Swami Brahmananda Saraswati was a tantric. So how it TM "Vedic
Meditation"? I was a teacher and we never were told to say that. Would
it be VM then? :D
P.N.
2009-10-25 18:26:45 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many
traditions, not just TM? Maharishi gave the definition and it is the
tradition of masters NOT just Swami Brahmananda Saraswati. In other
traditions it means their lineage. This makes TM'ers look naive.
Please remember what Mahesh yogi always said "TM is not tantra".
Non sequitur. That has nothing to do with what I said.
But you do realise that TM is a Vedic meditation and not a tantric
meditation.
Swami Brahmananda Saraswati was a tantric.
Mahesh yogi never told us that.

So how it TM "Vedic
Post by Bhairitu
Meditation"? I was a teacher and we never were told to say that. Would
it be VM then? :D
Well did Mahesh yogi ever tell you that TM is a tantric meditation? Mahesh
yogi never used the term tantric never.
dick blisters
2009-10-25 18:50:31 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
http://www.srigurudev.net/
Swami Brahmananda Saraswati was a tantric.
Where did you get this information?
Post by Bhairitu
So how it TM "Vedic Meditation"? I was a teacher and we never were told
to say that.
What did you teach?
Post by Bhairitu
Would it be VM then?
What does VM stand for?
willytex
2009-11-17 17:02:47 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM?
At alt.meditation.transcendental, 'Guru Dev' means only one thing -
a reference to our Swami Brahmananda Saraswati.

The TM bija mantras are derived from the tantric Sri Vidya tradition
of
Karnataka. Swami Brahmananda Saraswati belonged to the Saraswati
sampradaya which is headquartered at Sringeri. Swmaiji's guru was
Swami Krishananda Saraswati. All the Saraswati gurus follow the Sri
Vidya tradition. The TM bija mantras are enumerated in the main
scripture of Sri Vidya, the Saundaryalahari which was composed by
the Adi Shankara.

Read more:

Auspicious Wisdom:
http://www.rwilliams.us/archives/srividya.htm

Excerpt from 'Auspicious Wisdom":

"Like the other Sankara texts, it is possible that SL was composed
either in the Sankara matha of Srinigeri or Kanchipuram. The
attribution
of these four works to Sankara solidifies connections between smarta
brahmans, who identify with one of the southern Sankara pithas, and
Sakta and Srividya traditionalists.

Srividya appears to have undergone something of a reformation in the
south in the period of the composition of these texts. Between the
ninth and twelfth centuries, southerners distance themselves from
Kashmiri Kaulism in order to distinguish Srividya from morally
suspect
Tantrism. Sakta non-dualism is broadly construed to be compatible
with Sankara's advaita Vedanta, though points of difference are
rarely
articulated and no serious effort is made to address them."

Work cited:

"Auspicious Wisdom"
by Douglas Renfrew Brooks
State University of New York Press, 1992
(page 47-48)
Bhairitu
2009-11-17 20:04:53 UTC
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Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM?
At alt.meditation.transcendental, 'Guru Dev' means only one thing -
a reference to our Swami Brahmananda Saraswati.
The TM bija mantras are derived from the tantric Sri Vidya tradition
of
Karnataka. Swami Brahmananda Saraswati belonged to the Saraswati
sampradaya which is headquartered at Sringeri. Swmaiji's guru was
Swami Krishananda Saraswati. All the Saraswati gurus follow the Sri
Vidya tradition. The TM bija mantras are enumerated in the main
scripture of Sri Vidya, the Saundaryalahari which was composed by
the Adi Shankara.
http://www.rwilliams.us/archives/srividya.htm
"Like the other Sankara texts, it is possible that SL was composed
either in the Sankara matha of Srinigeri or Kanchipuram. The
attribution
of these four works to Sankara solidifies connections between smarta
brahmans, who identify with one of the southern Sankara pithas, and
Sakta and Srividya traditionalists.
Srividya appears to have undergone something of a reformation in the
south in the period of the composition of these texts. Between the
ninth and twelfth centuries, southerners distance themselves from
Kashmiri Kaulism in order to distinguish Srividya from morally
suspect
Tantrism. Sakta non-dualism is broadly construed to be compatible
with Sankara's advaita Vedanta, though points of difference are
rarely
articulated and no serious effort is made to address them."
"Auspicious Wisdom"
by Douglas Renfrew Brooks
State University of New York Press, 1992
(page 47-48)
As Willy *well* knows we don't know where MMY got the presently used
techniques. The Shankaracharya says that technique is not theirs.
Another book by an early TM teachers infers he learned the process from
a priest at a south Indian temple.

Also as Willy *well* knows MMY didn't start out with the present system
but gave out shanti mantras which is very common among traditions.

There are many systems for giving mantras. One is based on the
nakshatra of the Moon in your horoscope and sounds associated with it.
You can probably find that system somewhere online. Another is that
gurus will observe a devotee for a while and give him a mantra that is
appropriate for the personality that person exhibits. You can find a
description of that in the Devananda's book on meditation. Some gurus
will ask you "what is your favorite deity" and give you a mantra for that.

And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an accomplished acharya creating a
technique so there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it up if he
was an accomplished acharya.

Mantra shastra is not rocket science.
P.N.
2009-11-17 22:44:13 UTC
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Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM?
At alt.meditation.transcendental, 'Guru Dev' means only one thing -
a reference to our Swami Brahmananda Saraswati.
The TM bija mantras are derived from the tantric Sri Vidya tradition
of
Karnataka.
But Maharishi never ever called his meditation "Tantric" did he Bhairitu?.
Bhairitu
2009-11-18 19:51:14 UTC
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Post by P.N.
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Sigh. Did you know that the term "Guru Dev" is used in many traditions,
not just TM?
At alt.meditation.transcendental, 'Guru Dev' means only one thing -
a reference to our Swami Brahmananda Saraswati.
The TM bija mantras are derived from the tantric Sri Vidya tradition
of
Karnataka.
But Maharishi never ever called his meditation "Tantric" did he Bhairitu?.
He didn't because Indians are afraid of tantra and think it is black
magic (which it isn't) and westerners think it is about sex (which it
isn't). He was "trying" to secularize the techniques.
willytex
2009-11-17 22:49:26 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
As Willy *well* knows we don't know where
MMY got the presently used techniques.
Meditation is a technique that is common all
over India, especially in the sect of the Sri
Vidya. In that tradition they meditate on the
bija mantras of Trupurasundari and Saraswati.

It's the same bija mantra given out in TM
initiation. It's the same technique - it's a
meditation using a bija mantra of Saraswati.

We can assume that the Maharishi learned
meditation from his Master, Swami Brahmananda
Saraswati who was intiated by his guru, Swami
Krishnanada Saraswati. All the gurus in the
Saraswati lineage meditate on the bija
of Saraswati. Their headquarters is at Sringeri.
Post by Bhairitu
The Shankaracharya says that technique is not
theirs.
According to the Shankarachary of Jyotirmath the
meditation technique used in TM originated with
the Vedic sage Naryana. It's the same meditation
that is used by all the Shankaracharyas in that
lineage.
Post by Bhairitu
Another book by an early TM teachers infers
he learned the process from a priest at a south
Indian temple.
This doesn't even make any sense - the Maharishi
had been meditating for over fourteen years when
he visited the temple in South India. According
to Maharishi he learned everything from his
Master, the Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath. Are
you suggesting that the Maharishi did not learn
how to meditate from his Master?
Post by Bhairitu
Also as Willy *well* knows MMY didn't start
out with the present system but gave out shanti
mantras which is very common among traditions.
This is incorrect - the very first TMer, Raja Rao,
that was intiated in Kerala, has stated that the
TM technique is the very same technique given out
today by TM teachers. This is all explained in
'Beacon Light of the Himalayas'.
Post by Bhairitu
And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an
accomplished acharya creating a technique so
there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it
up if he has an accomplished acharya.
Maybe so. But I'm not understanding why you're
not willing to assume, as I do, that if the
Maharishi spent fourteen years with his Master,
and that Master was a master of meditation whose
guru was a meditation master, who was a guru in
the Saraswati lineage, why would the Maharishi
have to go to a temple in South India to learn a
bija mantra technique, a technique that is
common all over India and in the Himalayas?
Bhairitu
2009-11-18 19:58:47 UTC
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Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
As Willy *well* knows we don't know where
MMY got the presently used techniques.
Meditation is a technique that is common all
over India, especially in the sect of the Sri
Vidya. In that tradition they meditate on the
bija mantras of Trupurasundari and Saraswati.
It's the same bija mantra given out in TM
initiation. It's the same technique - it's a
meditation using a bija mantra of Saraswati.
We can assume that the Maharishi learned
meditation from his Master, Swami Brahmananda
Saraswati who was intiated by his guru, Swami
Krishnanada Saraswati. All the gurus in the
Saraswati lineage meditate on the bija
of Saraswati. Their headquarters is at Sringeri.
He would have received a Saraswati mantra wouldn't he, Willy? And why
is that?
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
The Shankaracharya says that technique is not
theirs.
According to the Shankarachary of Jyotirmath the
meditation technique used in TM originated with
the Vedic sage Naryana. It's the same meditation
that is used by all the Shankaracharyas in that
lineage.
I doubt it. In fact someone visited that math and they told him they
didn't teach what Maharishi was teaching. You just made this up.
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Another book by an early TM teachers infers
he learned the process from a priest at a south
Indian temple.
This doesn't even make any sense - the Maharishi
had been meditating for over fourteen years when
he visited the temple in South India. According
to Maharishi he learned everything from his
Master, the Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath. Are
you suggesting that the Maharishi did not learn
how to meditate from his Master?
It would be no different if a guitar teacher ran into another teacher
who showed him some cool techniques to use for his students. Some
people think MMY came up with the current system to differentiate
between a McMeditation and the other schools. ;)
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Also as Willy *well* knows MMY didn't start
out with the present system but gave out shanti
mantras which is very common among traditions.
This is incorrect - the very first TMer, Raja Rao,
that was intiated in Kerala, has stated that the
TM technique is the very same technique given out
today by TM teachers. This is all explained in
'Beacon Light of the Himalayas'.
Not what others claim that got the technique back then including
Bhagawan Das who wrote about it in his book. Do you know him?
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an
accomplished acharya creating a technique so
there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it
up if he has an accomplished acharya.
Maybe so. But I'm not understanding why you're
not willing to assume, as I do, that if the
Maharishi spent fourteen years with his Master,
and that Master was a master of meditation whose
guru was a meditation master, who was a guru in
the Saraswati lineage, why would the Maharishi
have to go to a temple in South India to learn a
bija mantra technique, a technique that is
common all over India and in the Himalayas?
I've only got a little over 4 years to go to be "14 years at the feet of
my guru." Should I start a cult then, Willy? :D
dick blisters
2009-11-18 21:26:03 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an
accomplished acharya creating a technique so
there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it
up if he has an accomplished acharya.
Maybe so. But I'm not understanding why you're
not willing to assume, as I do, that if the
Maharishi spent fourteen years with his Master,
and that Master was a master of meditation whose
guru was a meditation master, who was a guru in
the Saraswati lineage, why would the Maharishi
have to go to a temple in South India to learn a
bija mantra technique, a technique that is
common all over India and in the Himalayas?
I've only got a little over 4 years to go to be "14 years at the feet of
my guru." Should I start a cult then, Willy? :D
Why not do it if you believe you have the knowledge, ability and potential
to do so?

One question: If, as you say, you have had a master for nearly 14 years, why
don't you spend your time focusing on this master and the teachings instead
of being negatively focused and argumentive about TM here on
alt.meditation.transcendental?

I guess you don't even hve to be practicing the TM technique for it to work
as you seem to be doing a lot of unstressing on this newsgroup.
Bhairitu
2009-11-19 00:55:20 UTC
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Post by dick blisters
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an
accomplished acharya creating a technique so
there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it
up if he has an accomplished acharya.
Maybe so. But I'm not understanding why you're
not willing to assume, as I do, that if the
Maharishi spent fourteen years with his Master,
and that Master was a master of meditation whose
guru was a meditation master, who was a guru in
the Saraswati lineage, why would the Maharishi
have to go to a temple in South India to learn a
bija mantra technique, a technique that is
common all over India and in the Himalayas?
I've only got a little over 4 years to go to be "14 years at the feet of
my guru." Should I start a cult then, Willy? :D
Why not do it if you believe you have the knowledge, ability and potential
to do so?
One question: If, as you say, you have had a master for nearly 14 years, why
don't you spend your time focusing on this master and the teachings instead
of being negatively focused and argumentive about TM here on
alt.meditation.transcendental?
I guess you don't even hve to be practicing the TM technique for it to work
as you seem to be doing a lot of unstressing on this newsgroup.
Pointing our misconceptions is not unstressing.

BTW, I can already teach meditation from my new tradition. I didn't
have to wait 14 years.
dick blisters
2009-11-19 02:22:21 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by dick blisters
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an
accomplished acharya creating a technique so
there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it
up if he has an accomplished acharya.
Maybe so. But I'm not understanding why you're
not willing to assume, as I do, that if the
Maharishi spent fourteen years with his Master,
and that Master was a master of meditation whose
guru was a meditation master, who was a guru in
the Saraswati lineage, why would the Maharishi
have to go to a temple in South India to learn a
bija mantra technique, a technique that is
common all over India and in the Himalayas?
I've only got a little over 4 years to go to be "14 years at the feet of
my guru." Should I start a cult then, Willy? :D
Why not do it if you believe you have the knowledge, ability and
potential to do so?
One question: If, as you say, you have had a master for nearly 14 years,
why don't you spend your time focusing on this master and the teachings
instead of being negatively focused and argumentive about TM here on
alt.meditation.transcendental?
I guess you don't even hve to be practicing the TM technique for it to
work as you seem to be doing a lot of unstressing on this newsgroup.
Pointing our misconceptions is not unstressing.
Unstressing never appears to be unstressing to the person doing the
unstressing. It is always rationalized and justified as purposful and
comceptualized as important and meaningful.
My next question: What is the toxic source of your messiah complex?

Your Freudian slip is showing: I realize you meant "Pointing out
misconceptions" and not "Pointing our misconceptions"
Post by Bhairitu
BTW, I can already teach meditation from my new tradition. I didn't have
to wait 14 years.
I am very interestd to know what type of meditation you teach and who taught
it to you?
Bhairitu
2009-11-19 05:14:01 UTC
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Post by dick blisters
Post by Bhairitu
Post by dick blisters
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And BTW,there is nothing wrong with an
accomplished acharya creating a technique so
there would be nothing wrong with MMY making it
up if he has an accomplished acharya.
Maybe so. But I'm not understanding why you're
not willing to assume, as I do, that if the
Maharishi spent fourteen years with his Master,
and that Master was a master of meditation whose
guru was a meditation master, who was a guru in
the Saraswati lineage, why would the Maharishi
have to go to a temple in South India to learn a
bija mantra technique, a technique that is
common all over India and in the Himalayas?
I've only got a little over 4 years to go to be "14 years at the feet of
my guru." Should I start a cult then, Willy? :D
Why not do it if you believe you have the knowledge, ability and
potential to do so?
One question: If, as you say, you have had a master for nearly 14 years,
why don't you spend your time focusing on this master and the teachings
instead of being negatively focused and argumentive about TM here on
alt.meditation.transcendental?
I guess you don't even hve to be practicing the TM technique for it to
work as you seem to be doing a lot of unstressing on this newsgroup.
Pointing our misconceptions is not unstressing.
Unstressing never appears to be unstressing to the person doing the
unstressing. It is always rationalized and justified as purposful and
comceptualized as important and meaningful.
Why do you think I'm unstressing?
Post by dick blisters
My next question: What is the toxic source of your messiah complex?
What messiah complex?
Post by dick blisters
Your Freudian slip is showing: I realize you meant "Pointing out
misconceptions" and not "Pointing our misconceptions"
Just rapid typing.
Post by dick blisters
Post by Bhairitu
BTW, I can already teach meditation from my new tradition. I didn't have
to wait 14 years.
I am very interestd to know what type of meditation you teach and who taught
it to you?
Try: http://powertouchyoga.com
willytex
2009-11-22 16:37:40 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
He would have received a Saraswati mantra
wouldn't he, Willy?
Yes, the Maharishi recieved the Saraswati bija mantra
from Guru Dev - MMY said so, and this was confirmed
by the Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath. All the Saraswati
gurus meditate on the Saraswati bija mantra. It is
incumbent on all Saraswati gurus to meditate on the
Saraswati bija mantra at least twice a day.
Post by Bhairitu
And why is that?
All of the close disciples of SBS recieved the Saraswati
bija mantra to meditate on. From what I've read, this bija
mantra was advocated by the Adi Shankara. The Adi
placed a Sri Chakra on the mandir at Sringeri with the
TM Saraswati bija inscribed on it. The most holy scripture
of the Saraswati gurus is the 'Saundaryalahari' composed
by the Adi, which contains the Saraswati bija matra.
Post by Bhairitu
According to the Shankarachary of Jyotirmath the
meditation technique used in TM originated with
the Vedic sage Naryana. It's the same meditation
that is used by all the Shankaracharyas in that
lineage.
I doubt it. In fact someone visited that math and
they told him they didn't teach what Maharishi was
teaching. You just made this up.
The Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath has on many occasions
said that he approved of Maharishi's TM and that he
used the same technique, whuch he learned from SBS.
You can all about this is Jay Latham's book, 'Galaxy
of Fire".

"This was a great honor for Maharishi, and demonstrated
in the most symbolic way possible that he was held in
highest esteem by the present Shankaracharya Order;
with both the reigning and retired Shankaracharyas of
Jyothirmath in attendance.

They obviously regarded Maharishi as the most enlightened
disciple of their own guru, Swami Brahmananda Saraswati
(Guru Dev). I had heard that Swami Vishnudevananda was
supporting Maharishi and his movement in recruiting
Indians for the mass group practice of the TM-Sidhi
program..."

Read more:

From: Willytex
Subject: Galaxy of Fire
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental
Date: June 3, 2002
http://tinyurl.com/yzmth3z
Bhairitu
2009-11-22 17:53:26 UTC
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Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
He would have received a Saraswati mantra
wouldn't he, Willy?
Yes, the Maharishi recieved the Saraswati bija mantra
from Guru Dev - MMY said so, and this was confirmed
by the Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath. All the Saraswati
gurus meditate on the Saraswati bija mantra. It is
incumbent on all Saraswati gurus to meditate on the
Saraswati bija mantra at least twice a day.
And what is the Saraswati bija mantra?
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And why is that?
All of the close disciples of SBS recieved the Saraswati
bija mantra to meditate on. From what I've read, this bija
mantra was advocated by the Adi Shankara. The Adi
placed a Sri Chakra on the mandir at Sringeri with the
TM Saraswati bija inscribed on it. The most holy scripture
of the Saraswati gurus is the 'Saundaryalahari' composed
by the Adi, which contains the Saraswati bija matra.
Wrong answer. Try again.
willytex
2009-11-23 19:50:04 UTC
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Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
He would have received a Saraswati mantra
wouldn't he, Willy?
Yes, the Maharishi recieved the Saraswati bija mantra
from Guru Dev - MMY said so, and this was confirmed
by the Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath. All the Saraswati
gurus meditate on the Saraswati bija mantra. It is
incumbent on all Saraswati gurus to meditate on the
Saraswati bija mantra at least twice a day.
And what is the Saraswati bija mantra?
The nick-name of Saraswati. All TM teachers know what
the Saraswati bija mantra is.
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And why is that?
All of the close disciples of SBS recieved the Saraswati
bija mantra to meditate on. From what I've read, this bija
mantra was advocated by the Adi Shankara. The Adi
placed a Sri Chakra on the mandir at Sringeri with the
TM Saraswati bija inscribed on it. The most holy scripture
of the Saraswati gurus is the 'Saundaryalahari' composed
by the Adi, which contains the Saraswati bija matra.
Wrong answer. Try again.
Wrong about what?
Bhairitu
2009-11-23 20:05:54 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
He would have received a Saraswati mantra
wouldn't he, Willy?
Yes, the Maharishi recieved the Saraswati bija mantra
from Guru Dev - MMY said so, and this was confirmed
by the Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath. All the Saraswati
gurus meditate on the Saraswati bija mantra. It is
incumbent on all Saraswati gurus to meditate on the
Saraswati bija mantra at least twice a day.
And what is the Saraswati bija mantra?
The nick-name of Saraswati. All TM teachers know what
the Saraswati bija mantra is.
You're dodging the question again. It is not the nickname of Saraswati.
I think you are confused between a bij akshara and a bij mantra. They
are actually two different things.
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
And why is that?
All of the close disciples of SBS recieved the Saraswati
bija mantra to meditate on. From what I've read, this bija
mantra was advocated by the Adi Shankara. The Adi
placed a Sri Chakra on the mandir at Sringeri with the
TM Saraswati bija inscribed on it. The most holy scripture
of the Saraswati gurus is the 'Saundaryalahari' composed
by the Adi, which contains the Saraswati bija matra.
Wrong answer. Try again.
Wrong about what?
You don't know what a bij mantra is. See the above response. And it
wasn't what I asked anyway but you have snipped the phrase that I asked
that I question about.
willytex
2009-11-24 17:51:40 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
The nick-name of Saraswati. All TM teachers know what
the Saraswati bija mantra is.
You're dodging the question again. It is not the nickname of
Saraswati.
You are incorrect - the bija mantra of Saraswati is a nickname
of Saraswati (Tripurasundari) and all the TM Teachers know what
the bija mantra is. It's the same bija mantra chanted at the Sringeri
Ashram of the Adi Shankaracharya; the same bija mentioned in the
Saundaryalahri composed by the Adi.
Post by Bhairitu
I think you are confused between a bij akshara and a bij mantra.  
They are actually two different things.
The Adi Shankara did not teach that the bija mantra of Saraswati
is two different things. Shankara taught that the bija mantra of
Saraswati is One - non-dual - and that the bija mantra is the same
thing as Saraswati - there is no difference. Apparently you are
just making stuff up, trying to confuse people.
Post by Bhairitu
You don't know what a bij mantra is.
"Bija mantras (meaningless seed sounds) are mnemonic
devices used for experiencing the subtle states of
conciousness..."

Read more:

From: Willytex
Subject: Mantra v. 10
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental
Date: May 7, 2002
http://tinyurl.com/yhtr864
Bhairitu
2009-11-24 20:07:04 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
The nick-name of Saraswati. All TM teachers know what
the Saraswati bija mantra is.
You're dodging the question again. It is not the nickname of
Saraswati.
You are incorrect - the bija mantra of Saraswati is a nickname
of Saraswati (Tripurasundari) and all the TM Teachers know what
the bija mantra is. It's the same bija mantra chanted at the Sringeri
Ashram of the Adi Shankaracharya; the same bija mentioned in the
Saundaryalahri composed by the Adi.
Willy, you're trying to pass yourself off as an expert and you were
never even a TM teacher. You're the blind leading the blind. I was a
TM teacher and I learned more by going outside the movement and finally
found someone who was willing to teach me about mantras.

Your definition is that for a "bij akshara" not a "bij mantra." The
term "bij mantra" means "seed mantra" and the same as a "guru mantra."
There are at least "108 names of Saraswati" and any one of them can be
used for a guru mantra. How the guru mantra is picked is particular to
each tradition. The reason it is called a "seed mantra" is because it
is used to empower other mantras.
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
I think you are confused between a bij akshara and a bij mantra.
They are actually two different things.
The Adi Shankara did not teach that the bija mantra of Saraswati
is two different things. Shankara taught that the bija mantra of
Saraswati is One - non-dual - and that the bija mantra is the same
thing as Saraswati - there is no difference. Apparently you are
just making stuff up, trying to confuse people.
We know who is making things up here. You're like the people we used to
have who would come to meetings at the TM center claiming to "know all
about TM" and would spout off nonsense. They were not teachers and were
too unstable to be approved for TTC.
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
You don't know what a bij mantra is.
"Bija mantras (meaningless seed sounds) are mnemonic
devices used for experiencing the subtle states of
conciousness..."
Change mantra to akshara and you would have the correct definition.
willytex
2009-11-24 20:55:07 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
You are incorrect - the bija mantra of Saraswati is a nickname
of Saraswati (Tripurasundari) and all the TM Teachers know what
the bija mantra is. It's the same bija mantra chanted at the Sringeri
Ashram of the Adi Shankaracharya; the same bija mentioned in the
Saundaryalahri composed by the Adi.
Willy, you're trying to pass yourself off as an expert and you were
never even a TM teacher.
Apparently I know about the origins of the TM bija mantras than the
Maharishi himself. And compared to most TM Teachers, I am an
expert. It's a fact that most TM Teachers don't have a clue where the
TM bija mantras came from. And apparently some have never even
heard of the Saundaryalahari of Shankaracharya.

You are a case in point: didn't your guru tell you that the TM bija
mantra of Saraswati originated with the Saraswati tradition of
Sringeri? Maybe he doesn't even know ithat but youcould do a
little research instead of just trying to confuse people with your
double-speak nonsense.
Post by Bhairitu
There are at least "108 names of Saraswati" and any one of them
can be used for a guru mantra.
According to the Shankaracharya of Sringeri, the Adi Shankara placed
the Sri Chakra, symbol of Tripurasundari, with the TM mantras
inscribed
thereon, at each of the seats of learning - Dwarka, Puri, Sringeri,
Kanchi
and at Jyotirmath. The mantras of TM are DIRECTLY related to Sri
Vidya. At least three TM bija mantras appear inscribed on the Sri
Chakra!

Reference:

'The Secret of the Three Cities'
An Introduction to Hindu Sakta Tantrism
by Douglas Renfrew Brooks
University Of Chicago Press, 1990

"Auspicious Wisdom"
by Douglas Renfrew Brooks
State University of New York Press 1992

Read more:

From: Willytex
Subject: Secret of the Three Cities'
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental,
alt.yoga, alt.meditation
Date: July 13, 2009
http://tinyurl.com/y9pjv7w

Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental,
alt.yoga, alt.meditation
Date: August 26, 2003
http://tinyurl.com/y89xc2x

From: Willytex
Subject: Saundaryalahari
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental
Date: December 1, 2004
http://tinyurl.com/y8q5jv6
Bhairitu
2009-11-25 00:21:48 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
Post by willytex
You are incorrect - the bija mantra of Saraswati is a nickname
of Saraswati (Tripurasundari) and all the TM Teachers know what
the bija mantra is. It's the same bija mantra chanted at the Sringeri
Ashram of the Adi Shankaracharya; the same bija mentioned in the
Saundaryalahri composed by the Adi.
Willy, you're trying to pass yourself off as an expert and you were
never even a TM teacher.
Apparently I know about the origins of the TM bija mantras than the
Maharishi himself. And compared to most TM Teachers, I am an
expert. It's a fact that most TM Teachers don't have a clue where the
TM bija mantras came from. And apparently some have never even
heard of the Saundaryalahari of Shankaracharya.
You are a case in point: didn't your guru tell you that the TM bija
mantra of Saraswati originated with the Saraswati tradition of
Sringeri? Maybe he doesn't even know ithat but youcould do a
little research instead of just trying to confuse people with your
double-speak nonsense.
Self proclaimed gurus are a dime a dozen. I guess you want to join that
club too?
Post by willytex
Post by Bhairitu
There are at least "108 names of Saraswati" and any one of them
can be used for a guru mantra.
According to the Shankaracharya of Sringeri, the Adi Shankara placed
the Sri Chakra, symbol of Tripurasundari, with the TM mantras
inscribed
thereon, at each of the seats of learning - Dwarka, Puri, Sringeri,
Kanchi
and at Jyotirmath. The mantras of TM are DIRECTLY related to Sri
Vidya. At least three TM bija mantras appear inscribed on the Sri
Chakra!
'The Secret of the Three Cities'
An Introduction to Hindu Sakta Tantrism
by Douglas Renfrew Brooks
University Of Chicago Press, 1990
"Auspicious Wisdom"
by Douglas Renfrew Brooks
State University of New York Press 1992
From: Willytex
Subject: Secret of the Three Cities'
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental,
alt.yoga, alt.meditation
Date: July 13, 2009
http://tinyurl.com/y9pjv7w
What? You don't list any Indian references? Why don't you read up on
some of those? There are bookstores in the US that have those books in
stock.

But bookish knowledge just stays in the books. You'll get more from an
authentic teacher. Start searching...
P.N.
2009-11-24 23:17:25 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
"Bhairitu" <***@sbcglobal.net> skrev i en meddelelse news:J1XOm.78294$***@newsfe23.iad...
.
Willy, you're trying to pass yourself off as an expert and you were never
even a TM teacher. You're the blind leading the blind. I was a TM
teacher and I learned more by going outside the movement and finally found
someone who was willing to teach me about mantras.
Your definition is that for a "bij akshara" not a "bij mantra." The term
"bij mantra" means "seed mantra" and the same as a "guru mantra." There
are at least "108 names of Saraswati" and any one of them can be used for
a guru mantra. How the guru mantra is picked is particular to each
tradition. The reason it is called a "seed mantra" is because it is used
to empower other mantras.
We know who is making things up here. You're like the people we used to
have who would come to meetings at the TM center claiming to "know all
about TM" and would spout off nonsense. They were not teachers and were
too unstable to be approved for TTC.
Post by Bhairitu
You don't know what a bij mantra is.
As far I can see you are trying to debate philosophy through mudslinging and
personal attacks on mr Willy. I come to think of John Manning a true master
of shitslinging.
Bhairitu
2009-11-25 00:18:11 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by P.N.
.
Willy, you're trying to pass yourself off as an expert and you were never
even a TM teacher. You're the blind leading the blind. I was a TM
teacher and I learned more by going outside the movement and finally found
someone who was willing to teach me about mantras.
Your definition is that for a "bij akshara" not a "bij mantra." The term
"bij mantra" means "seed mantra" and the same as a "guru mantra." There
are at least "108 names of Saraswati" and any one of them can be used for
a guru mantra. How the guru mantra is picked is particular to each
tradition. The reason it is called a "seed mantra" is because it is used
to empower other mantras.
We know who is making things up here. You're like the people we used to
have who would come to meetings at the TM center claiming to "know all
about TM" and would spout off nonsense. They were not teachers and were
too unstable to be approved for TTC.
Post by Bhairitu
You don't know what a bij mantra is.
As far I can see you are trying to debate philosophy through mudslinging and
personal attacks on mr Willy. I come to think of John Manning a true master
of shitslinging.
Willy should know better. He's been doing this for years. If he wants
to stand upon the stage and get mud slung at him I guess that's his choice.

Do actually believe what he is telling you or do you know better?

All I'm trying to do is show how this stuff really works. If you don't
want to believe me go do some research then. You won't find it inside
the TMO though because it is dumbed down yoga. You'll have to go to
other sources.

Of course if you want to make TM a dogma....
willytex
2009-11-25 20:47:58 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bhairitu
Post by P.N.
As far I can see you are trying to debate philosophy
through mudslinging and personal attacks...
Do actually believe what he is telling you or do you know
better?
So, let's sum up what we know:

Guru Dev was from the tradition of the Saraswati Order of the
Shankaracharya Sampradaya. His teacher was Swami
Krishnanand Saraswati of Uttar Kashi, a meditation master.
The Mahesh Yogi spent fourteen years with SBS, learning
yoga and meditation, and seva.

Sringeri Matha was founded by the Adi Shankara and the
gurus in that line take as their surname Saraswati. Guru
Dev recieved the bija mantra of Saraswati from his teacher,
just like his teacher had recieved the bija from his teacher,
all the way back to the Adi Shankara, who founded the
order at the Sringeri Matha.

All the Saraswati gurus in the lineage meditate on the
Saraswati bija manta which is inscribed on the Sri Chakra
placed on the madir at Sringeri by the Adi. The bija mantra
of Saraswati is meditated upon by the Shankaracharya of
Jyotirmath in the Himalayas - the only direct surviving
lineage that leads back to Guru Dev - SBS.

Guru Dev taught many diciples how to meditate on the
Saraswati bija mantra. The TM bija mantra of Saraswati is
the same bija used by all the Saraswati sanyasins. They
all meditate twice a day, at least, using the Saraswati bija.

It's the same Saraswati bija given out by the Mahesh Yogi,
who got it from his master, SBS.

The Saraswati bija mantra is enumerated in the
Saundaryalahari composed by the Adi Shankara. It's also
inscribed on the Sri Chakra. There is a Sri Chakra at
Sringeri Matha and at Puri Matha. Guru Dev had a small,
portable, ruby-encrusted Sri Chakra, which is now at the
Jyotir Matha.

"According to Swami Rama of the Himalayas, Guru Dev
was a proponent of the Sri Vidya, and that Guru Dev used
to worship a ruby-encrusted Sri Chakra with the TM bijas
mantras inscribed on it..."

Work cited:

'Living With the Himalayan Masters'
By Swami Rama

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